India pak future relationship?

Discussion in 'The Pavilion' started by pat, Aug 19, 2019.

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  1. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    So, Article 370 is done and dusted and PMIK can't stop crying about it. Sent back ambassdor, suspended trade, closed the air space.

    Is this all temporary drama bazi or for good? no more "cultural exchanges", medical tourism, sporting ties etc etc?

    or simply see which stance serves them best and pick them choose based on the specific occasion?

    2020 t20 is coming up fast.
     
  2. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    Wonder if this should be allowed by GOI given the relations between the two countries.

     
  3. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    The bitch also has the audacity to knock on India while Indians are donating blood to save her dad. She also says hospital got thousands of dollars and so its not charity. take your money and go somewhere else Maybe china or middle east.

    Time for India to reciprocate and end all travel between the two countries
     
  4. Mohan
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    Mohan Formerly 'Captain Clutch'

    Nov 4, 2014
    4,109
    Modi is now going to receive UAE's highest civilian award next month.

    So will Dimran severe his ties now with UAE, on whose loans Pakistan is breathing?

    My bet is no, because the highest amount of remittances come from there and it employs 2.5 million Pakistanis.

    So basically everything is about dollars. Their army will kill Muslims around the world for dollars, doesn't matter if it comes from dushman USA or murderer Saudis or iron brothers China. While they will show their fake concern towards Muslims of Kashmir and peddle lies against India.

    What a banana republic!
     
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  5. MNA
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    MNA Smooth Operator

    Mar 11, 2015
    3,244
    The situation will normalize within 6-12 months. Trade will resume, ambassador sent back, cultural exchanges taking place, and other co-operation re-started. You might see IK and Modi meeting up for real.

    Time to clear up all the drama, let the dust settle and continue with life as usual. (as long as India and Pak remain behind the LOC)
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2019
  6. Major
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    Major Cornered Tiger

    Apr 28, 2010
    12,544
    I dont think dust will settle on this.

    the Article 370 thing is a very huge thing, and they will fight this diplomatically and if not then i seriously thhink that things can get real messy.

    Pakistan might take a step that could result in war. Maybe a kargil like event so that US gets involved and then India is forced to place article 370 back

    Nothing is quiet right now. THey are using every diplomatic powers they got. UN, ICJ etc.
     
  7. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    UNSC is done and dusted. They couldn't even agree on a statement

    ICJ has no jurisdiction. besides annexing of GB will become a problem for Pakistan.

    Indian would gladly welcome a war. would crater Pak economy for good and US will have its way on Afg.
     
  8. Major
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    Major Cornered Tiger

    Apr 28, 2010
    12,544
    Diplomatic effort isn't done yet,

    See India never wanted Kashmir issue to be discussed in UN in the past, now thats happening and this going to be problematic for India.

    Also, no country is going to be fighting a full war or a world war type war LMAO.

    There might be a small battle and threats be given out to each other, so that USA the real father comes and makes the both coutnry to sort out the issue, and thats when i think the article 370 would have to be restored.
     
  9. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    what is the UN going to do? the decisions are made by the UNSC and that too the permanent members. Rest is just lip service. USA is too busy with election next year and trade war with China. China is too busy with HK riots.UK and Fance are too busy with Brexit. Russia has a very good relation with India and has openly siad it should be sorted out mutually.

    Not fighting a full war? if pak starts something, it would have no say on how big a war. Pak economy is in the crapers.

    Your whole premise is that USA will ride to Pak's rescue? big risk to take. Delusional I might add. Might explain why a country of 200 million people have a foreign reserve of less than $20B and living on IMF handouts

    Hope pak starts something. 1) It would wreck its economy for good and 2) end opposition parties in India for good.
     
  10. Major
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    Major Cornered Tiger

    Apr 28, 2010
    12,544
    again you are just going crazy and even understanding the point.

    WHen did i said a resolution would be passed? Where did i said that?

    Kashmir has never been discussed before and getting it discussed is a very big achievement for Pakistan. ANd hopefully this issue would be sorted out by these boides.

    As for the war, its not going to be a full fledged it will be a small scale one and the results of it will get US and other major coutnries to stop it from happening and getting the article 370 restored somehow.

    Escalation of a subcontinent war would be a concern for US and other countries due to the nuclear threat.

    But right now the diplomatic procedures would need to be followed and hope that it get sorted out this way which looks quite unikely but atleast its getting discussed
     
  11. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    you sound like a broken record and under impression that someone else will bail you out after you start trouble. I'll entertain you.

    1) the only reason why UNSC discussed is because as permanent member of UNSC, china can force a discussion. However, they could not even get it to a open discussion or even agree on a statement. In essence, the cheen shot blanks. the genral assembly is you usual rona dhona.

    2) why are you under the impression that Pak has control over the scale of the war? Remember '65? a unprepared India almost took Lahore. India is better armed and fully expecting Pak to try something stupid. the policy of teh Indian current government is to escalate to level where pak can't tolerate

    Pak is more prone to external pressure than India. keep that in mind.

    FATF meeting is coming up in october and Pak CAD is still negative. Imagine what will happen in case of a war.

    world is not stupid enough to reward a terrorist country for its tantrums.

    3) Diplomatic pressure: You sound like brits talking about "alternatives arrangements to backstop" Instead of spouting that phrase non stop, provide some details. Paks best shot was at UNSC via China. that was a major dud. What else is there?
     
  12. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    https://nation.com.pk/22-Aug-2019/will-no-longer-seek-dialogue-with-india-pm-imran

    Prime Minister Imran Khan has said he would no longer seek dialogue with India.

    “There is no point in talking to them. I mean, I have done all the talking. Unfortunately, now when I look back, all the overtures that I was making for peace and dialogue, I think they took it for appeasement,” said he in an interview with with an American news media site, days after India revoked special status of Occupied Kashmir amid a security clampdown.

    The occupied Muslim region still remains under curfew since August 5.

    “There is nothing more that we can do,” said Khan.


    <snicker>

    Does he mean no interactions or just no more drama bazi about Kashmir?
     
  13. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
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  14. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
    12,114
    Khan slowly creating an international narrative. In a month he has made the Kashmir issue bigger globally then the past governments did in 60 years combined. Khan & Pakistan has done very possible effort of dialog, who's fault is it if Indian (the fascist state) isnt listening?

    Speaking of 'drama bazi' (refer to post # 16), wait few days and watch what kinda massive 'drama bazi' India will do to divert world's attention from IoK.
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2019
  15. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
    12,114
    Big diplomatic achievement of Pakistan, no question about it.

    Will UNSC or other bodies be able to resolve it, absolutely not. If that was the case, then Israel and Palestine conflict wouldve been resolved long time ago.
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2019
  16. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
    12,114
    Here we go... India is making ground to do another false flag attack within just like Pulwama. Inline are their two possible objectives out of it.

    A) Divert world's attention from IoK.

    B) Frame Pakistan so that FATF blacklist Pakistan.



    Countrywide alert sounded after group of 4 along with ISI agent enter India

    A high alert was sounded in the entire country including Rajasthan-Gujarat border on Monday after the district administration came to know that a group of four along with an ISI agent have entered the country on Afghanistani passports.

    "Four people with an ISI agent on Afghanistani group passports have entered India due to which a high alert has been sounded in the country, including Rajasthan and Gujarat border. They can carry out terrorist activity anytime," says the letter from Sirohi Superintendent of Police (SP) Kalyanmal Meena, which has been sent to all police stations in the district.

    https://www.indiatoday.in/india/sto...with-isi-agent-enter-india-1582508-2019-08-20
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2019
  17. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    Business as usual?

    https://dailytimes.com.pk/452323/pakistan-allows-entry-of-afghan-trucks-to-india-despite-tensions/

    Foreign Minister Shah Mahmood Qureshi said on Thursday that Pakistan has not stopped Afghan trucks from taking goods to India despite Pakistan’s suspension of trade with India.


    Talking to delegates of the Pak-Afghan track-II dialogue at the Foreign Office Qureshi said Afghan trucks are allowed to cross Wahga border and take goods up to the Indian border town of Attari.


    Afghanistan had long been demanding Pakistan to allow its land route for trade with India, but Islamabad rejected the facility in view of disputes with India.

    Qureshi’s statement indicates a major shift in Pakistan’s policy amid tension with India following Indian government’s decision to revoke the special status to Indian-held Kashmir.
     
  18. Passionate Pakistani
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    Passionate Pakistani The Don

    Jun 10, 2011
    68,210
    Things shaping up nicely for Ghazwa Hind boys.. get ready for the Greater Pakistan.
    We shall inshAllah destroy this barbaric, inhumane, stinky Modi soon.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
     
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  19. Major
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    Major Cornered Tiger

    Apr 28, 2010
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    lol ghazwa e Hind?

    Thats just a made up story
     
  20. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
    12,114
    No offense but it tells how much you know about our religion - I presume you are Muslim, Major.
     
  21. Major
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    Major Cornered Tiger

    Apr 28, 2010
    12,544
    oh bhai, ghazwa e hind is just made up.

    There is only one slight refrence on it not even direct, and it could be about anywar.

    Plus, ghazwa e hind is only famous because of some guy called naimatullah shah wali.

    Infact, ghazwa e hind is something that is used by terroirst groups like Lashkar e Taiba to give justification for what they are doing.

    There arnt any neutral sources on it, most of them are by Pakistani "scholors". If this was indeed a major thing, i am sure there would had been more info about this by neutral islamic scholars.

    They say troops will attack India but India as it is today didn’t even exist until after the Mughals decided on the name.
     
  22. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
    12,114
    First of all, I am certain now that you dont know anything about Ghazwa e hind, therefore you called it made up. It is not necessary that things you don’t know are fake and if you want to know please do some research before spreading false information.

    It is a broad term. Ghazwa e hind just not only mean the Army who will attack Hind or current INDIA,it will also Fight for whole Muslim world.

    On the topic, ghazwa e hind part I would like to start with a hadeeth. This Hadith regarding Ghazwa-e-Hind is narrated by Hazrat Subban (R.A.) states:

    Two groups amongst my Ummah would be whom Allah has freed from fire; one group would fight against India & the Second would be that who would accompany Isa Ibn-e-Maryam(A.S.)”.

    It has been also quoted by Imam Ahmad (R.A) in his ‘Musnad’ and Imam Nisai (R.A) in his ‘Musnad’. Besides, these ‘Musnads’ are added into the ‘Sihah Sitta’.

    The ‘ahadith’ relating to Ghazwa e Hind are shrouded with many misunderstandings. Let us look into these ‘ahadith’ so that we may gather correct comprehension of these ‘ahadith’.

    From the outset, one clarification needs to be made. Word ‘ghazwa’ is usually used to describe a ‘qattal’ in which our Nabi (saww) took part physically; and word ‘sriya’ is used to describe a ‘qattal’ in which our Nabi (saww) did not take part physically. It may be appreciated that such a differentiation between ‘ghazwa and non-ghazwa’ has been made by historians (or narrators) for their convenience; such a differentiation is not based on Arabic grammar. In Arabic, word ‘ghazwa’ is used for ‘qattal’ whether our Nabi (saww) took part or no part in such ‘qattal’. What I am suggesting is that all ‘ahadith’ in which word ‘ghazwa’ has been used to describe ‘qattal’ in India do not mean that our Nabi (s.a.w.w) would take part in such ‘qattal’ physically.

    The first ‘hadith’- regarding Ghazwa e Hind- which is narrated by Hazrat Suban (r.a.) states as follows:

    Two groups amongst my Ummah would be whom Allah has freed from fire; one group would fight against India & the Second would be that who would accompany Isa Ibn-e-Maryam(a.s.)”.

    This above stated ‘hadith’ has been quoted, among others, by Imam Ahmad (r.a) in his ‘Musnad’ and by Imam Nisai (r.a) in his ‘Musnad’. Both these ‘Musnad’ are included in the ‘Sihah Sitta’.

    This ‘hadith’ states that two groups of Muslim Ummah have been declared free from Hellfire; one group consists of those persons who would fight against India, and the second group is that which would accompany hazrat Isa (a.s). It may be appreciated that Hazrat Isa's (a.s) all companions would not have joined him (a.s) simultaneously; rather the companions would have joined Hazrat Isa (a.s) at various periods of time. It means hazrat Isa's (a.s) companions joining him (a.s.) at various periods of time are one group for the purpose of the good news given in this ‘hadith’. Similarly all Muslims fighting against India (non-Muslim India) at various periods of time are addressee of this hadith. In other words, all persons who have taken part in battles fought against India until now- and who would take part in such battles till Qiyamah- are addressee of the ‘basharat’ contained in this hadith. It is a great ‘basharat’ for those who, being Muslim Ummah, have got opportunity- and will get such opportunity in future- to fight against India; all such persons are free from Hellfire though they have not embraced ‘shahadat’. This above quoted hadith is a sahih hadith.

    The other quoters of this hadith include Imam Bukhari (r.a) in ‘Al Tareekh Al Kabeer’; Tibrani; Behqi; Ibn-e-Kaseer; Imam Welmi; Imam Syuti; Imam Mazi; Ibn-e-Asaakar in ‘History of Damascus.

    The second hadith, relating to Ghazwa e Hind, and narrated by Abu Huraira (r.a) states as follows:

    “ In this Ummah, the troops would be headed towards Sindh & Hind

    Hazrat Abu Hurairah (R.A.) says "if I could find a chance to participate in any such expedition, and I get martyred, then well & good; if I come back as a survivor, then I would be a free Abu Hurairah, to whom Allah Almighty would have given freedom from the Hell.”

    This hadith has been stated by Imam Hambal in his ‘Musnad’, as such it is also a sahih hadith. Imam Nisai also narrated this hadith in both his books: ‘Al- Sunan Al Mujtaba’ & ‘Al Sunan Al Kubra’ with the following wordings:

    Hazrat Abu Hurairah (r.a) says, Hazrat Muhammad (s.a.w.w) promised us of Ghazwa-e-Hind. If I get chance to participate in it, I would spend all my energy & wealth for it. If I get killed, I would be considered among the most great martyrs. And if I come back alive, then I would be a freed Abu-Hurairah.

    This second hadith actually endorses the first hadith wherein there is a ‘bushrah’ that a Muslim taking part in fighting against India would be free from Hellfire.

    The words ‘Muhammad (s.a.w.w) promised us of Ghazwa e Hind’ shows the highest degree of assurance given by our Nabi (s.a.w.w) to the happening of this event i.e. Ghazwa e Hind.

    It may be appreciated that both ‘ahadith’ quoted above state about Muslims’ battles against India; these ‘ahadith’ do not state about conquest of India.

    The third hadith, relating to ghazwa e Hind and narrated by Hazrat Abu Huraira (r.a) states about conquest of India as follows:

    “Definitely, one of your troop would do a war with Hindustan, Allah would grant success to those warriors, as far as they would bring their kings by dragging them in chains / fetters. And Allah would forgive those warriors (by the Blessing of this great war). And when those Muslims would return, they would find Hazrat Isa Ibn-e-Maryam(a.s.) in Syria”.

    It may be appreciated that this above quoted hadith is not included in ‘sehah Sitta’, though Naeem bin Hammad (r.a) quoted this hadith in his book ‘Kitab ul Fitan’ and Ishaq bin Rahuya(R) also quoted this hadith in his ‘Musnad’, with few additions.

    Even if this ‘hadith’ is to be relied, it should not convey the theme that India would be conquered only near Qiyamah when Hazrat Isa (a.s) would descend on this earth. We know that Muslims have conquered India many times in the past, and Muslims may conquer India many times in the future before Qiyamah. We do not have to wait for Qiyamah to conquer India. But, of course, it may be so that for the last time we would conquer India near Qiyamah. It may also be appreciated this hadith also states about forgiveness of those who would have participated in the expedition.

    The fourth hadith, relating to Ghazwa e Hind, narrated by Hazrat Kaab (r.a) states as follow:

    A King of Jerusalem (Bait-ul-Muqaddas) would make troops move forward towards India. The warriors would destroy the land of Hind; would possess its treasures, then King would use those treasures for the décor of Jerusalem. That troops would bring the Indian kings in front of King (of Jerusalem). His warriors by King’s order would conquer all the area between East & West. And would stay in India till the issue of Dajjal”.

    This above quoted hadith is also not included in ‘Sehah Sitta’ though Naeem bin Hammad(r.a), the teacher of Imam Bukhari(r.a) did narrate this hadith in his book ‘Kitab- ul-Fitan’.

    The fifth hadith, relating to Ghazwa e Hind, and narrated by Hazrat Safwan (r.a) states as below:

    “Some people of my Ummah will fight India, Allah would grant them success, even they would find the Indian kings being trapped in fetters. Allah would forgive those warriors. When they would move towards Syria, then would find Isa Ibn-e-Maryam(A.S.) over there”.

    This hadith also is not included in ‘Sehah Sitta’ but has been quoted by Naeem bin Hammad in his book ‘Al-fitan’.

    Both fourth and fifth ‘hadith’ endorse each other to the extent that India would be conquered by Muslims at some point of time in the future. This hadith also states that the warriors taking part in the expedition would be forgiven by Allah.

    We may conclude that out of five ‘ahadith’ and their various versions quoted above, four ‘ahadith’ state about forgiveness of those warriors who would take part in battles against India. Moreover, all these ‘ahadith’ state about Muslims’ battles against India and some ‘ahadith’ state about conquest of India by the Muslims near Qiyamah but it does not mean that we cannot conquer India until near Qiyamah; we have conquered India many times in the past, and we can conquer India many times in the future before Qiyamah.

    Online References (page 337/580)

    nisai2

    [​IMG]

    Apologies – I know I provided way too much info, but I had to provide all the references and quotes on the subject.
     
  23. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
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  24. ASLI-PATHAN
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    ASLI-PATHAN Cricistan Khan

    Apr 26, 2011
    63,380
    There is no future. War will happen sooner rather than later. The future will be written by the gun. Muslims in India are being butchered like cows in Pakistan and you are seeking for a future. Modi the killer deserves only bullet to the head.
     
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  25. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
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    Pak govt actions so far seems contrary to your opinion.
     
  26. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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  27. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
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    Becos its the truth. backed by science! bring back Pirates!

    R'Amen
     
  28. Mycroft Holmes
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    Mycroft Holmes Talented

    Feb 5, 2014
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    RT has officially been corrupted by the ISI.
     
  29. Mycroft Holmes
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    Mycroft Holmes Talented

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  30. Mycroft Holmes
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    Mycroft Holmes Talented

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  31. Mycroft Holmes
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    Mycroft Holmes Talented

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  32. MNA
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    MNA Smooth Operator

    Mar 11, 2015
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    Nothing will happen, absolutely nothing.
     
  33. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
    12,114
    Truth for you, sure keep on believing whatever you want to.
     
  34. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
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    The Great Spaghetti Monster will win over everyone.

    You will worship his noodliness!
     
  35. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
    12,114
    Chal ba chal ... only people like you believe on such BS.
     
  36. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    Guess medicines from evil hindu nazis is ok to use.

    Can't believe India is actually even exporting. makes me want to puke.

    https://www.geo.tv/latest/246497-pa...ith-india-amid-tensions-over-occupied-kashmir

    ISLAMABAD: The federal government on Monday allowed the import of life-saving medicines from India in order to provide relief to patients amid bilateral tensions with New Delhi over the illegal annexation of Indian-occupied Kashmir last month.

    The permission to import and export medicines to and from the Hindu-majority country was granted by the Ministry of Commerce, which issued a statutory regulatory order in this regard.

    Last month, Pakistan suspended bilateral trade with neighbour India after the latter illegally annexed Indian occupied Kashmir by revoking the special constitutional autonomy of the occupied valley through a presidential order rushed through the parliament.

    Hundreds of thousands of additional troops were posted in the valley following the order and a military curfew imposed. Thousands of Kashmiri political leaders, businessmen, civil activists and other ordinary citizens were arrested.

    International media are now reporting widespread torture and abuse of these detainees by the Indian security forces. Some reports have even claimed that India is denying medical care to patients. Last week, US Senator Bernie Sanders expressed concern in this regard.

    Moreover, Pakistan is also contemplating closing its airspace for Indian flights and is also discussing other measures aimed at downgrading bilateral ties with India to protest the moves in the occupied valley.
     
  37. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586

    <crickets> LMAO.
     
  38. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
    586
    Guess importing medicine from genocidal counties is OK? f'n hypocrites. wonder why many in this board don't have the balls to say anything about this.

    Guessing India can expect visit from non-state actors as thanks for this atrocity.
     
  39. pat
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    pat Emerging Player

    Nov 25, 2018
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    Yo asli, got any ETA on that war?
     
  40. Shaz130
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    Shaz130 Talented

    Dec 29, 2016
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    If you ask Shoaib Malik and Hasan Ali its going good.
     
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