Islamophobia and Muslims in today's world.

Discussion in 'The Pavilion' started by Del, Apr 9, 2019.

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  1. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
    12,084
    Dont think this topic has been discussed here on CS much, therefore I would like to know what people here think about it.

    After you hear this word 'Islamophobia', first question comes in your mind, 'what is Islamophobia'? There could be multiple ways to describe it, but for me, its intense dislike or fear of Islam. More to the point, its world-view involving and unfounded dislike towards Muslims, which results in practices of exclusion and discrimination.

    Islamophobia promotes hatred & fear of Muslims and mostly Muslim communities living in western countries have been targeted and effected by this.

    That said, in your opinion, what is Islamophobia and what are the factor(s), which enable it?

    Also, what it's impact and how to encounter it?

    Discuss...
     
  2. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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  3. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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  4. ASLI-PATHAN
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    ASLI-PATHAN Cricistan Khan

    Apr 26, 2011
    63,379
    It is a fact and is very much real. How to tackle it? Just try to be yourself. Islam literally means peace and we shouldn't act like those who hate us. We are not the same and we can't reply them in the same way.
     
  5. Energy
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    Energy Cornered Tiger

    Apr 22, 2012
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    Muslims are facing a hard time in today's world. It is a fact like a AP mentioned. Its 'in your face' kind of stuff.

    With drinking, sex outside wedlock, gambling, interests etc all being declared haram, Muslims will face challenges integrating within the wider world where all of this is not only adapted, but now freely promoted. That's a tough situation to be in to be fair. LBGT for example is now the new buzz word.

    What do you do? You keep to yourself and you're already starting to be isolated. You keep to your group and you're labelled as a ghetto. You are also labelled backward if you don't 'blend in'. Its a fine line you would need to draw to please both ends, and we have successful examples of that i.e. Moeen Ali. But that's not the story of the masses.

    In the long run, you will need the Muslim majority countries like ME, Turkey, Malaysia, Pakistan, Bangladesh to be really strong economically and to venture into science & technology to drive any sort of change. Otherwise the Muslim community will face a hard time.
     
  6. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Couldn't agree more, but on contrary, how to stop attacks like New Zealand mosque attack or Quebec mosque shooting, because according to many these attacks were also triggered due to Islamophobia.
     
  7. ASLI-PATHAN
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    ASLI-PATHAN Cricistan Khan

    Apr 26, 2011
    63,379
    Mad man does what mad man do. You can't stop such attacks. The best you can do is to tell Non Muslims around you about the true essence of Islam. Show them the true picture and facts and not what their media is feeding them day in day out. Tell them about who really our Prophet (PBUH) was. About his compassion and his true character. Try to be good to your neighbours even if they are Non Muslims. Help the poor irrespective of their religion. This is the true Muslim Character.
     
  8. Patriot
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    Patriot Kaptaan

    Oct 8, 2014
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    well according to @KingOfDoosra Islam is not a religion of peace.
     
  9. Patriot
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    Patriot Kaptaan

    Oct 8, 2014
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    here even in the middle east, I have seen fear in the eyes of foreigners from Asia, Europe and America but the fear which the media has put in the masses cannot be removed with words only.
    People have to live with the people they fear to overcome their fear and whatever nonsense they have been believing about them.

    Fear is something you have about something you dont know and unless you get to know the people that you are afraid of and have been told certain things about them you wont ever see the real truth.
     
  10. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Indeed, many have this fear of unknown that something bad will happen to them, because this was instill in them.

    Also, I am not sure if you noticed or not, but there was a profound reaction of NZ mosque shooting and people latterly praising that move.
     
  11. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

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  12. Patriot
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    Patriot Kaptaan

    Oct 8, 2014
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    their PM, the lady should get all the credit. She is an example for all the leaders in this world. What she did is stop the spread of hate and reignite the peace among her people.

    This step of hers is encouraging those who live in fear of muslims and islam to take the next step to get to know about it. She is encouraging people to fight their fears
     
  13. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    This is my problem, what exactly their fear is? That any Muslim will kill or harm them? Are they really that stupid?

    There are bad people is every society, in every religion. NZ mosque shooter was a white christian so as Quebec mosque shooter, does it mean I should fear from every white christian?
     
  14. mohsin88ali
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    mohsin88ali Talented

    Nov 8, 2017
    1,254
    To be fairly honest, i don't see this "phobia" too far from being warranted, but that is just me as i almost always look inwards first. For me, the solution always lies within, it just needs admission of WHAT IS WHAT.

    Yes, they too become overzealous sometimes and yes, mad men like the NZ terrorist do "act" but there, these fanatics are an ACTUAL minority but here???

    Now, why wouldn't they fear us when....

    1: they see us tear each other from limb to limb in ACTUAL wars and in proxy wars like Syria and Yemen, that too in name of sects. Not to mention how these wars weaken us but we still insist on them and try to justify them from Islam.

    2: when Muslims kill each other in the name of the faith with little to no regard for innocent bystanders. (And many times other faiths as well)

    3: whenever a so called scholar says or even does something terrible, all the others rush to his aid, they start campaigns in his favour. (This happens more so in Pakistan but still, just look at mufti qavi incident)

    4: when they see that we are taught that the rest of the world is our "enemy" and that many, if not all terrorists act according to that.

    5: that no matter how horrendous the act, a vast majority of Muslims still try to defend it, and make excuses for the puppet traitor. (How many incidents can you name where Muslims did even 10% of what NZ's people and PM did?)

    6: when we are destroyed and displaced because of our own wars (Syria) and they give us asylum and the way we repay them...........by RAPING and MURDERING them.



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  15. Phenom
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    Phenom Emerging Player

    Aug 23, 2017
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    One of the major reasons of the increasing hatred against the muslims in the western countries is the terrorist activities that are carried on by the illegal organizations like ISIS. Due to these vile creatures who kill innocents in the name of ''jehad", muslims all over the world are percieved as violent and threat to the security of the locals.

    We as muslims are partially to be blamed for this in a sense that we have'nt displayed the true teachings of our peaceful religion.There are so many stereotypes about Islam which have nothing to do with the reality,are thrown around in the normal life which is really sad.

    So the solution to this problem would to communicate the true essence of Islam and disassociating ourselves from those disgusting organizations and integrating well with the local communities to the extent it is practicable for us as muslims.
     
  16. Patriot
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    Patriot Kaptaan

    Oct 8, 2014
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    media man, its all the media. Most of them dont even have a single clue about muslims and islam but they believe what the media shows and tells them.

    One of the main reasons I stopped watching news 15 years ago and life has been so much better. I have gained more information about the world by not watching news
     
  17. mohsin88ali
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    mohsin88ali Talented

    Nov 8, 2017
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    I couldn't agree more, well said.

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  18. Donal Cozzie
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    Donal Cozzie Tracer Bullet

    Nov 4, 2014
    7,208
    Islamophobia is as its defined. A fear/hatred of anything Muslim. There are many factors that enable it. The media is the prime culprit, with blatantly fear-mongering headlines about how all Muslims are coming to invade and take over or other nonsense.

    I also think the incompatibility of Islam at times with the more commonly observed ways of life in the west causes fear among some, mostly those who've never actually interacted with Muslims. They dont outright hate Muslims or anything of the sort, but they see a group of people who primarily keep to themselves, dont really adopt many local customs, speak a foreign language and it builds up an "us vs them" kind of mentality unconsciously, that "they" are different/against "us", "they" dont want to live "our" way of life it just places a mental barrier before anyone can even interact.

    Lots of people in the West are just totally ignorant of Islam/Muslims too and thats certainly a factor.

    I also think Muslims dont help themselves either in terms of their community leaders. In Ireland we're fortunate because the head of the only actual mosque on the island is articulate,outspoken and seems a great guy. Look at the NZ terror attack, awful as it is, the head of that mosque comes out a week later blaming it on the Jews. You see many Muslim leaders at times in the UK preaching outright extremism. Just seems to be an identity crisis. You see many Muslims displaying extreme homophobia or hostility towards discussions on many topics that they deem uncomfortable. You dont have to like these things, but there's a difference between saying "I dont like gay things but people are free to do it if they want" and "its bloody disgusting, should be banned, immoral, filth etc etc". In a culture where these things are being accepted seeing the vitriol some people direct towards those minorities can scare them.

    Its not a one way street, but I feel the main culprit is a disgustingly xenophobic right wing media that preach hate and too many ignorant people in the West buy it and forget that Muslims just wanna live their lives the same way as anyone. Most people dont give a toss about things, just want to work 9-5 Monday Friday and chill on a weekend. But I do think there are issues in both camps that contribute to it.

    My two cents
     
  19. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Valid point, and thats why there are number of Muslims scholars who condemn such activities and attacks and thats why this notion "Islam is religion of piece" came to fore, to show true essence of Islam. However, there is a division within Muslims and many will argue that "Islam is not religion of piece". So question is, what message does it broadcast to the world when we have contradiction?
     
  20. mohsin88ali
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    mohsin88ali Talented

    Nov 8, 2017
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    That we are trying to "save face"..

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  21. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Trying to save face on what?
     
  22. mohsin88ali
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    mohsin88ali Talented

    Nov 8, 2017
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    Instead of admitting our mistakes/criminals within us, we try to look like ANGLES and say that there are NO TERRORISTS in Islam.
    But they ARE, they are "from us" and they DO use OUR holy book to justify their horrible acts (no matter how false they are in understanding it)

    And all we do is either make excuses for them or try to deny their existence....

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  23. godzilla
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    godzilla Talented

    May 12, 2016
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    no, it has nothing to do with muslims, or their reactions to terrorism - there's a tonne of condemnations, unanimously, globally, from all kinds of institutions, its widely documented and published.

    what it has everything to do with is global geopolitics, power and money. on the fringe its ideological, but thats pretty much always fringe.

    fifty years ago it was communism, today it's islam. given the demographic dynamics, it will probably remain islam for a while.

    its interesting that the media monolith of ubiquitous institutionalised racism and islamophobia has been incredibly successful, with wars, political elections and now muslims also convinced that they are the problem, as is somewhat evident in this thread.

    its astonishing that the whole issue is so blindly decontextualised. I was invited to a party a few years ago where there were a couple of young friends who were sitting at my table. one was very right wing, the other very left wing. I was hoping the flavour of the day, islamophobia wouldn't come up, bit it did of course, particularly because the story of the day was the uk government passing a resolution to bomb syria I think it was.

    so the question came up and I persuaded the two guys to speak first. the pacifist said he was dead against military action and that diplomacy was the way forward, the right wing kid suggested that "we" nuke Mecca. quite seriously, and unapologetically. then they asked me.

    I asked them what they think would happen if not 130 or so people died in the then recent Paris attacks, but a million people, with ten million French people displaced, what the world reaction would be, given with 130 people, all the world leaders joined hands in solidarity to support the French people and this barbaric attack on humanity. given WWII, there is a precedent that when millions of people are involved, the west will resort to weapons of mass destructions, nuclear weapons in retaliation. so I asked, if thats what the west would likely do, or at least would want to do in that hypothetical, why they thought Iraqis, or Somalis, or afghanis would behave in any way differently. why they wouldnt want revenge and to strike back in exactly the same way that the west would. the only reason anyone would think that a nation ought not react in the same way as you would, is if you thought they were less important than you, something 'other' to you.

    this is what the problem is, and is the root cause of why islamophobia has been a successful social manipulation to hide economic and social bankruptcy in the west - the 'othering' of nations in order to make them a clear and present danger and enemy.

    you can't ignore context. this doesn't excuse terrorism, but it explains it - this is critical to avoid a dehumanisation, which lets face it, is a mandate for slaughter. if you look at which people were killed in the past ten, twenty, thirty, forty or fifty years globally, in wars, and violence, I think no one would disagree that the vast, vast majority have been muslim, if not by the west, certainly by their weapons on the whole. thats a context you cannot ignore in this discussion if you want to maintain any integrity.
     
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  24. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    I strongly disagree man, this could be your own judgment.

    I have never, ever seen or meet Islamic scholar who vouches for terrorism or terrorist. And I am talking about legit qualified people here, not gali mauhala's random Mullah here.

    On contrary, are you really that naive to say that orgs like Al-qaeda, ISIS, Taliban and Daesh show true colors of Islam?

    Also, who do you think financially supports them?

    To me, these groups are proxy tool and their masters pull their strings. Not to mention how much these tools have been used to damage Islam. Even a 10 years old in todays world know this fact.
     
  25. mohsin88ali
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    mohsin88ali Talented

    Nov 8, 2017
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    I already explained in my first post, that this is how I feel, and i am not forcing anyone to feel the same way...

    And i never said that these animals somehow represent "true Islam"
    I just said that the find "explanations" for their heinous actions from our own texts.(i also said that they were wrong in that regard)

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  26. mohsin88ali
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    mohsin88ali Talented

    Nov 8, 2017
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    And as far as scholars are concerned, you, my friend, have the luxury of living in Canada, which puts strong emphasis on religious freedom and tolerance.
    Can you honestly say the same for Pakistan? (with a straight face)


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  27. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Bro every such heinous action needs justification, some kind of rational (you cant go and kill for fun or because there was nothing to watch at TV and you were bored). So what could be better tool to misinterpret Islam by its own people and show the world that how evil Islam is.

    And yes, Pakistan case of religious freedom and tolerance is very different with tons of fanatics around, but thats society's issue more than religion.
     
  28. mohsin88ali
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    mohsin88ali Talented

    Nov 8, 2017
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    I agree, and THAT is why our response (or lack there of) becomes paramount.

    Our religious leaders are very quick when they issue kill decrees for minute matters but have they ever issued one for Usama, Mullah Umer, Abubaker al-Bhadadi etc for MASS MURDERING humans??
    I think not.

    If that seem radical, than how about excommunication?
    Saying that these people are "kicked out" of Islam.
    Have they ever done that?

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  29. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Bro again, I have seen and read many statements from knowledgeable scholars condemning their actions. They clearly have said it repeatedly that this is not what Islam teaches.

    I have already said you need to be sensible enough to understand the rational behind all this game, who is playing it and why. Its very easy to use such tools, aid them in every possible way and tell world, that look this is true Islam. Nobody will be more naive than us if we buy this narrative.

    I think there is nothing left to say on this.
     
  30. godzilla
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    godzilla Talented

    May 12, 2016
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    maybe you should read a bit more rather than repeating the brain washing politically motivated selectivity by the oligarchy of western press. theres a constant, repetitive, comprehensive, global, cross cultural and cross sectarian rejection of terror attacks constantly. so much so that books have been written just with press releases.

    for example:

    http://rissc.jo/condemning-terrorism/

    or any and all of the statements by any muslim organisation in terms of response to these events, for example the MCB:

    https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=mcb+condems+terrorism&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

    or the less than one second it takes, if you can be bothered to inform yourself before speaking, to search for "muslims condemning terrorism":

    https://www.google.com/search?safe=.......1..gws-wiz.......0i67j0i131j0.QH067qtXrSQ

    what else do you want? they issue official statements, from governments, institutions, figures, they march against it and so on.
     
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  31. Donal Cozzie
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    Donal Cozzie Tracer Bullet

    Nov 4, 2014
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    Have to agree with a lot of this. Ultimately the West bears a lot of responsibility, and the standard of education here in terms of giving people a proper global outlook is appalling, so few people leave school with any idea of the world, just encourages closed minds and a rejection of anything different, or encourages you to, intentionally or unintentionally, view it as inferior.

    I'd say comfortably half of all people at age 18 and some above know absolutely nothing about past history or current affairs aside from 9/11, WW2 and ISIS. Just have this weird view that the West was always glorious, Islam wants to destroy now suddenly and African nations like Libya/Congo were just stupid savages who cant do anything.
     
  32. godzilla
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    godzilla Talented

    May 12, 2016
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    To be honest I don’t think it’s particularly a wider cultural issue amongst western people, but it is in my opinion a cohesive and deliberate policy by media and politicians to decontextualise - there’s a limit to how much you can blame the average person who spares far more time worrying about keeping a job to pay the bills, as opposed to media moguls who don’t care the victims are of their sensationalist reporting in order to gain viewers and advertising dollars, or politicians who don’t care what the long term cultural damage is done by jumping onto a bandwagon of hate in order to secure votes of people looking to blame anyone else for their economic woes than the establishment who shepherd on a widening gap between rich and poor.

    0AB3BECA-9B18-4EFB-85C7-F36FB625DCF1.jpeg
     
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