Pakistani bowling seriously lack's penetration

Discussion in 'Cricket Talk' started by Del, Jan 22, 2019.

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  1. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Shaheen gave us the start which we needed to come back, but Faheem was total dud from the other end, who did absolute zilch to put pressure and take more wickets from other end.

    The in latter part, Shadab took 2 quick wickets, but Hafeez was generous to give away 4/6 in every over.

    Hassan looked very ordinary too and it is another massive concern. He take wickets in one game but then go totally missing in next game. Just like our batting, bowlers also lack consistency.

    Today, shadab brought us back in the game, but nobody raised his hand from other hand and we lost the game.

    Whilst I was watching our bowling, I get this impression that we seriously lack penetrate, we look good in patches but our bowling is unable to control the game and this has happened in past too.

    Also, as I said in another thread, bowlers hunt in pair, we dont have a pair of wicket taking bowlers, which captain can deploy to not only take wickets but also chock runs.

    Looking to see if others agree?
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2019
  2. s_h_a_f
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    s_h_a_f Whispering Death

    Dec 26, 2011
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    Missing that X factor
     
  3. Mohammed Bilal
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    Mohammed Bilal Tracer Bullet

    Jul 17, 2017
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    Our bowling is good not great but good, our batting is bang on average hitting mediocre.
     
  4. BuccalSingh
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    BuccalSingh Youngsta Beauty

    Mar 21, 2016
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    Played with just 4 bowlers of which Faheem was one of them.Need to play aamer in place of talat, we might have won this game had we played with one more wicket taking bowler.Too many bits and pieces cricketers in this team.
     
  5. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Mickey calls "bits and pieces players" all-rounders, and he think's its the way to go.

    Hope he release it now that you need at least 3 wicket taking bowlers, because you cant win games if you're not going to take wickets.
     
  6. KingOfDoosra
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    KingOfDoosra Sultan of Swing

    Jun 8, 2012
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    When you are adding in bits and pieces cricketers at the expense of specialist bowlers obviously that will have some effects.

    Faheem is completely useless with both bat and ball, Amir is better than him in both aspects yet he is being kept out.

    Talat another bits and pieces cricketer, dare I say, he can't bat nor bowl. Imad at least would have kept some pressure on.

    I know hindsight is a great thing but IMO our selection cost us the game today. Had Amir and Imad played instead of Faheem and Talat we would've never let them get away.
     
  7. Wistful Reminisces
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    Wistful Reminisces Banned

    Sep 21, 2012
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    Penetration, not penetrate.

    Bring Junaid in
     
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  8. Ahson8
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    Ahson8 Sultan of Swing

    Jun 9, 2012
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    Junaid looks the least penetrable at times even though he somehow manages to get wickets
     
  9. Ahson8
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    Ahson8 Sultan of Swing

    Jun 9, 2012
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    I thought Shaheen was very good at the top today and Shadab too, who was very unlucky not to get Andile since he struggled the whole game vs him.

    Hasan has been economical this series but hasn’t looked like taking wickets which isn’t good.

    Hafeez is just not the same after his action change.

    Also we don’t help ourselves by opening the bowling with Fahim. Hasan would use it much better.
     
  10. Mohammed Bilal
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    Mohammed Bilal Tracer Bullet

    Jul 17, 2017
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    Hasan has been a let down tbh, Faheem is just a parchi player whose runs can be made by Amir even.
     
  11. Ahson8
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    Ahson8 Sultan of Swing

    Jun 9, 2012
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    Fahim is not a ‘parchi’ but I agree he has not been good enough.

    Hasan needs to bowl with the new ball, I don’t know why the management is so shy to give him the new ball, I mean I’ve seen him get movement with the new ball in the PSL and his new ball spells in test cricket have been good too so I don’t get why he doesn’t get the new ball in ODIs
     
  12. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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  13. saiyan0321
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    saiyan0321 Cornered Tiger

    Oct 5, 2014
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    Missing the "good enough for international cricket" factor.
     
  14. saiyan0321
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    saiyan0321 Cornered Tiger

    Oct 5, 2014
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    Not even bits and pieces.. His own avgs in list A shocked me.. What allrouder has a list A avg of 59 with 13 wickets in 50+ games...

    Hassan is that classic part timer that a captain gives two overs two and then regrets his decision..
     
  15. Munna
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    Munna Moderator-e-Aala

    Oct 4, 2014
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    Apart from Shaheen and Shinwari, all other bowlers are the same guys who played in CT17... the same guys who kept doing good in T20s last year and everyone was going gaga about them.

    Teams are just better prepared now against the likes of Amir, Hassan, Shadab and all our railu kattas... Sarfraz can't just keep deploying the same tactics and expect the same results every time.

    Either you become absolutely solid in your basics like McGrath or Kohli or you become dynamic and change your gameplay with changing times.
     
  16. Fireworks11
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    Fireworks11 Kaptaan

    Sep 22, 2012
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    Fahim is not a one change bowler. At best he is a fourth seamer. Him being the third seamer totally releases all the pressure.

    Bring back Amir, need 3 out and out fast bowlers.
     
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  17. saiyan0321
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    saiyan0321 Cornered Tiger

    Oct 5, 2014
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    This. Teams actually work you out after your initial success this is exactly the reason why we have so many new batsmen crossing or nearing the fastest to thousand runs record but immediately fade away near or after it. They immediately figure it out that the batsman has these weaknesses.. Jamsheed, Awais Zia, sohaib maqsood and so many others... Our domestic record breakers and international smashers suddenly get worked out and we are left stunned.

    Simple teams work players out.. The difference that highlights the word "international standards" is that those players that have the determination to succeed become dynamic batsmen or bowlers.. They evolve and plan rather than using the same idea.. They improve and become the glue that holds the team together... This is the bare minimum that is required for players of top 5 teams.. This is the bare minimum required to classify as international standards..

    Only hard work can save these players but these guys run away from hard work like hafeez against steyn.
     
  18. Energy
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    Energy Cornered Tiger

    Apr 22, 2012
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    I think we have a fantasy for a fast bowling all-rounder. Faheem is at best a holding bowler. Why in the world would you want to open bowling with him? Besides, has no talent with the bat.
     
  19. Sultan Yusuf
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    Sultan Yusuf Talented

    Sep 1, 2010
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    The main point is that we have no-one who has the willingness to force the issue. When a team is chasing 200, you have to force them out. The batsmen don't need to take any risks. Bowl yorkers, hit the stumps, swing the damn ball, bowl as fast you can. Shaheen was bowling 132k in his later spells, Fahim 128k. And all bowling length, length, length. You won't get anywhere, the batsmen just need to defend it or flick it through the gaps for singles.

    We have abandoned all our innovations, magic deliveries, yorkers and pace in favour of "right areas", "tight lines", "wait for the mistakes". With this tactic you will only get wickets if the opposition are under pressure to score runs.

    Shaheen's opening spell was encouraging, I don't know why he was so down in pace in later spells, you only have to bowl 10 damn overs, that's it.
     
  20. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    The biggest problem is Hassan, he isnt taking wickets in the middle orders along with Shadab.

    We had issues in pick up early wickets, but Shaheen is bowling well upfront. Amir/Usman/Junaid can open bowling with former, however, you need to choke runs in the middle of the innings, kill momentum and take wickets. That's our problem is, I reckon.

    Also, Hafeez doesn't look like the same bowler either (I really hope he will start chucking in WC).
     
  21. Mohammed Bilal
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    Mohammed Bilal Tracer Bullet

    Jul 17, 2017
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    Hassan is bowling really well, really enjoyed his bowling in last two matches, pitches were slower but he bowled well as for rest agree with @Sultan Yusuf point.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2019
  22. Energy
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    Energy Cornered Tiger

    Apr 22, 2012
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    Hasan is fine, and is a good trump bowler to have. But he needs two front bowlers on the top, similar to Amir, Junaid in CT.

    Faheem opening the bowling is a slap on the face of every great bowler who has used the new cherry to make a name for himself.
     
  23. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    I agree on on Faheem, but if Hassan is fine, then why he is not taking wickets?

    Shaheen gave ideal start in last game, when he came on attack & failed to take wickets.

    Shadab gave us 2 quick wickets, but then again when he came on attack, still didnt yield any wicket.

    I see it as a problem.
     
  24. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Its proven again today...

    Nobody was able to take wickets, even though this time we played with our "A" bowling attack - Amir, Shaheen, Hassan, Imad and Shadab.

    If you cant defend 310+ then better stop playing cricket, because our batters cant score 380-400.
     
  25. s_h_a_f
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    s_h_a_f Whispering Death

    Dec 26, 2011
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    Bhai Saffer bowlers struggled too. This pitch is tailor made for batting. Pak out of all teams scoring 300+ says it all lol.
     
  26. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    So we have to make 375-400 to win on this pitch?

    Sorry but I dont buy it.

    Our bowlers bowled very poorly.
     
  27. BuccalSingh
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    BuccalSingh Youngsta Beauty

    Mar 21, 2016
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    Wicket was perfect batting track, however our bowlers were very poor too.They were just able to take 1 wicket, had indian bowlers been defending such a target, they might have ended up losing the match, but would have performed far better on this pitch.
    Pak bowling is very very ordinary these days.
     
  28. axl100mph
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    axl100mph Emerging Player

    Nov 23, 2016
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    Well, this version of Amir needs to go and get his issues fixed. I have elaborated on that before

    Shaheen is fine, let him develop, and so his Hasan, although just a minor tweak in his action and he can add 5 kph to his bowling, which will really help given his height.
    Junaid or any other geriatric trundler won't do. He is a spent force anyway and so is Wahab. Shinwari has to get his leading arm a little lower or else he will remain to be a 140 kph bowling machine.
    We need to blood in somebody else who has ability. I am hoping that Haris Rauf develops well, and the youngsters like Nasim shah and Musa are also shaping up well.

    However, what we really need is another specialist spinner, and for me Zafar Gohar and irfan the leggie are good options. Both of them spin the ball and are a wicket taking threat against good batsmen unlike the darters that we love so much.

    As an additional bonus, both of them can bat, and Gohar is a gun fielder.
    Remember, Shadab is being forced into a lead spinner when in fact he should be playing second fiddle.
     
  29. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    I was excited when I watched Haris Rauf, but experts of CS said that his actions isnt legit, what do you think?

    I second you on Zafar, who should not only play in ODI but also in Test, specially in UAE. But as usual, they will give him chance once he's on the downhill, so that they can say look, we knew it - he is not good.

    On a different note, how Usman is taking wickets? What has changed in his bowling? Or its just that world hasn't seen him yet.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2019
  30. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    What a difference today, just one bowler changed, open attack was changed and SA was bowled out on below par score.
     
  31. s_h_a_f
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    s_h_a_f Whispering Death

    Dec 26, 2011
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    I think they read this thread!
     
  32. Mohammed Bilal
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    Mohammed Bilal Tracer Bullet

    Jul 17, 2017
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    Hassan bowled well in this series so far.
     
  33. Inswinger
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    Inswinger Tracer Bullet

    Mar 6, 2010
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    Who are you talking about? Faheem has a good bowling record in domestics.
     
  34. Bilal123
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    Bilal123 Tracer Bullet

    Dec 11, 2010
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    The difference seen today in bowlers was due to captaincy I think.

    Malik knows how to captain. He's got the best brain in the country for captaincy.
    Some of his field placings were good. Like having 2 slips and a gully/ short extra cover in place on 25th over. I loved watching fielders around the bat. Showed he was in it for the wickets.

    Sarfraz often pulls the fielders back once batsmen cross 10 runs.
     
  35. saiyan0321
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    saiyan0321 Cornered Tiger

    Oct 5, 2014
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    Hussain talat.
     
  36. axl100mph
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    axl100mph Emerging Player

    Nov 23, 2016
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    I would like to know which so called expert called haris for chucking, because he is completely fine. He has good mechanics and is loaded with fast twitch fiber muscles which allow him to generate that velocity and pace in his action.

    Coming to Usman, yesterday plenty of factors went his way, which paved the way for that spell to happen.
    It was malik's good attacking captaincy that created the pressure by bringing shaheen and Amir who bowled very well. By the time Usman came in to bowl, the batsmen were looking to break free, and he managed to extract a bit of reverse, which was too much, especially for the tail.

    In terms of the technical aspects is concerned, nothing has changed really. He has just gotten a little stronger, hence the slight pace increase.
    However, we cant rely on him as a wicket taker because his mode of operation doesnt trouble the best batsman. He just cant bring the ball back from that action.His lead arm needs to go a bit lower and he needs to stop pulling out of his action-as can be seen how his face is pointing to the side at delivery. Only then will he be able to become a genuine wicket taking threat against top batsmen
     
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  37. Del
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    Del Cornered Tiger

    Dec 21, 2016
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    Actually found this old thread, wherein @maddgenius @s_h_a_f & @Prince Pathan called him chucker.

    https://cricistan.com/threads/psl-4-who-is-who.47968/#post-1375960

    As for Usman, I also had similar feeling that nothing has changed, except he has gained some extra pace. The biggest issue with him and Amir is that both are unable to bring the ball "in" to the right handers. That incoming ball is a must not only to keep batsmen quiet but it also a wicket taking option.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2019
  38. s_h_a_f
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    s_h_a_f Whispering Death

    Dec 26, 2011
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    Yup. Rauf has a dodgy action.
     
  39. axl100mph
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    axl100mph Emerging Player

    Nov 23, 2016
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    What is dodgy about this?
    I wonder most of you would have called Bumrah a chucker too. These express men have more flexibility and leverage in their joints which gives them the pace. However, people who don't understand biomechanics take this extra whippage in the wrist as elbow flexion, when it is not.
     
  40. Mohammed Bilal
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    Mohammed Bilal Tracer Bullet

    Jul 17, 2017
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    Don’t know why they cannot give him a go in T20s, stupid PCB treat T20s like Tests.
     

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