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Where does Pakistan Cricket Go From here?

Discussion in 'Cricket Talk' started by ahmedwaqas92, Jul 4, 2019.

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  1. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    10 teams have come to play and perform! You came and performed upto the mark and could not make it but still did better than many others and infact surprised lots of people! Why do you always need to start from the scratch after every world cup and build a completely new team altogether everytime and prepare for next 10 yrs or so? Just pick up the broken pieces, select those players whom you think can still do well for us and drop those whose performance was not upto the mark!! We dont need to do a 2004 everytime we lose a world cup!! Inzi has left behind a nucleus that can serve us for next 4 years atleast - the likes of Harris Sohail, Abid Ali and Rizwan. Others like Babar, Fakhar, Amir are regular part of the team!!
     
  2. isaacking
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    isaacking Talented

    Jul 16, 2010
    2,349
    Moment u say that u bowl both of and leg spin, call urself spin wizard of 15 yrs experience, I feel pity for u.

    Just record ur top spinner and flipper for me and post it. While u are at it bowl an traditional off spinner too.

    If u can't and surely u can't then plz stop labeling urself.

    It is preferable to be Man of Understanding then to be a Man of Knowledge.
     
  3. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    I have left cricket since 4 years. I am retired from cricket long time back. I am not fit enough to play cricket anymore and too busy in my professional life for anything related to active sport!!
     
  4. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    You don't understand what I intended to say. I'm saying that there is something wrong fundamentally with the way Pakistan cricket is organized and played. That results in substandard cricketers being given long extended careers. Hafeez and Malik aren't someone who could play 15+ years of international cricket even for a team like SL or WI for example.

    What that does is that the players who then are called up to the national squad play for themselves and not for the team. Yes, Make a 50-60 and then my place is safe. You've got the likes of Sarfaraz berating cricketers in public, unfit cricketers, incorrect diet. Where does that come from? The myth right now is that cricket is a talent based game. It isn't , Not anymore. You won't get talented cricketers like Wasim Akram bowling in the streets of Pakistan again. The game has changed far too much for that to be possible. There is an increasing level of importance given to fitness etc even in the domestic circuit. Any changes to the national team will not have any trickle down effect to the changes in the domestic teams.

    Also, The new ruling by Imran is welcome.The same players who have failed in the International cricket but are "domestic greats" would be filling up quite a lot of the places in the teams and the youngsters will have to fight for lesser number of berths. That breeds competition and allows for a process wherein the youngsters aren't picked for the national side after a couple of FC matches but instead perform consistently for the team for a period of 2 years against "close to" international standard players.

    But that's something that takes time, so Pak needs to choose its coaches for the 6 or 8 regional teams very wisely, Having that over a period of 2 years would probably start getting better prospects in. As of now, A Shaheen Afridi is liable to get dropped once he tapers off and that destroys careers. Had he come in with 2-3 years of sustained performances against quality opposition, He won't be dropped on bad performances or even if dropped, can prove himself and make a comeback

    Unless Pak makes these changes, the fans back up these changes and not oscillating like a pendulum on "isko drop karo-isko pick karo" after every 2 matches , then there's a chance they can claw back lost ground. Otherwise, It's the same. Replace 4-5 members of the squad , Replace the captain , get some bounceback results initially and then go back to the same mire once the players get comfortable and the circle repeats itself
     
  5. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Totally agree with you! The changes that are required only one man can bring in Pakistan and that is the Prime Minister of the Country, who happens himself to be the greatest cricketers of all times!!
     
  6. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    He can only point the way forward, If the people concerned dont take it up and execute well, It will be the same old
     
  7. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    He takes personal interest in cricket cus we all know who Imran was!!
     
  8. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    Lets see how it works out. Yes, he's interested in the game and has always talked about having structure like the australian one. But give it time, results won't come immediately and there will be setbacks. Stop wishing for one player to replace the other every second match and oscillating.
     
  9. isaacking
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    isaacking Talented

    Jul 16, 2010
    2,349
    I left cricket 10 yrs back but I am sure that I'll be able to bend the ball back into right handed batsman as left arm seamer even now.

    The excuse for a wizard spinner that he had not played for 4 yrs is laughable.

    It is preferable to be Man of Understanding then to be a Man of Knowledge.

    Or u can accept that u r not u say u r and end it now.
     
  10. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Bhai you have maintained your fitness!! I havent! After becoming a Wakeel 4 years ago, I lost control of my diet and gained 4x weight cus of all the good food we eat! Wakeelon ko Foujiyon wala khaana milta hai full ayaashi!! Agar mein cricket field per utron abhi to 4 bande stretcher per wapis laayeinge!!
     
  11. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Army walon ka lifestyle hai mera!!
     
  12. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Awaam ko daal bhi sahi nahi milti aur hum log high level food khaate hein!
     
  13. isaacking
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    isaacking Talented

    Jul 16, 2010
    2,349
    No bhai I weight 87 ritenow but I trust this old body of mine to bowl 2 overs on any given time by grace of Allah.

    Let me make it easy for u just record the realise of ball I'll accept it if u are able realise flipper,top spinner and off spin.



    It is preferable to be Man of Understanding then to be a Man of Knowledge.
     
  14. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    I used to bowl offspin with Saqlains action and leg spin with Shahid Afridi action!!
     
  15. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    I'm not particularly fit right now but I reckon I can bowl 3-4 overs of spin bowling.
     
  16. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    My offspinner would land straight at the toes of the batsmen ball after ball!! Leg spin would lure the batsman into playing an expensive shot and getting them out at point with a slip, short 3rd and point - 3 fielders on the off side behind the batsman!! I would keep right hander in that area and dont allow him to move from that area!!
     
  17. isaacking
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    isaacking Talented

    Jul 16, 2010
    2,349
    Saqlain had a pause and afridi use rush through, I'll love to see u bowl now with ur wizardry turns.

    It is preferable to be Man of Understanding then to be a Man of Knowledge.
     
  18. isaacking
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    isaacking Talented

    Jul 16, 2010
    2,349
    U are bowling darts as off spin more like jaysuriya no turn open to slaughter between cover to mod wicket.

    U are not a complete leg spinner unless u turn few googly and master top spinner and flipper.

    Please stop calling urself wizard and let shadab work on his flight and pace to become better LOI bowler.

    It is preferable to be Man of Understanding then to be a Man of Knowledge.
     
  19. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    I could bowl with that Afridi action even now maybe if i try dont know havent been on a cricket field for 4 years it would be terribly difficult for me! But to bowl with that Saqlain action, you need to be slim like Saqlain otherwise you will end up like Shoaib Malik instead! Saqlain was quick to crease whereas as I gained weight I couldnt move that quickly to bowl with that action any longer and that has become more of a Shoaib Malik now!! My batting improved as I grew older and I used to play as Captain for Karachi team and batted as an opener!!
     
  20. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Not bowling darts, Saqlain as an offspinner would also bowl at the toes of the batsman keep that middle and leg stump line and keep bowling there!! Accuracy and consistency is important for an offspinner! Variation is very important! Judging the movement of the batsman what he is about to do all were my tricks of the trade!!
     
  21. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Shadab should work on his flight cus he is a proper leg spinner and not fastish leg spinner like Afridi!!
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2019
  22. isaacking
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    isaacking Talented

    Jul 16, 2010
    2,349
    Now u r talking gibberish and I have no time to explain u where n everywhere u are going wrong.

    Ppl who saw saqlain bowl will know that he was never bowling on toes (negative line) he was an attacking bowler bowling just on off stump or bit on middle.

    It is preferable to be Man of Understanding then to be a Man of Knowledge.
     
  23. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Nahi Saqlains line was always middle and leg stump more than middle even in test matches!! Wasim Akram kept on insisting him to bowl that off stump line but he would not agree and bowl that leg stump line to right hander all the time and with his doosras he will keep bamboozling the batsmen!! Same goes for me!! Just see proper clips of Saqlains bowling! Dont think you have watched Saqlain as closely as me!! He was my first bowling hero when i started cricket and i copied him and i was the first one to copy him atleast at my club when he arrived on the scene against Slanka!!
     
  24. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    The only time Saqlain bowled middle was when he was looking for his doosra
     
  25. Shaz130
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    Shaz130 Talented

    Dec 29, 2016
    1,019
    It won’t go anywhere if we try the same tried and tested failures.
     
  26. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Take out the old clips of Saqlain and you would see for yourself!! I have followed Saqlain very closely throughout his and my career!!
     
  27. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    I have even heard Wasim Akram saying in the commentary that he tried throughout his career to force Saqlain into bowling that offstump line but Saqlain would never agree to bowling offstump line even when Sachin used to paddle sweep him all the time during that Chennai test innings!!
     
  28. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    As an offie, Saqlain generallly bowls outside offstump to batsmen. He did have a tendency to go towards the middle stump when he was trying his arm ball or his doosra. That's about it. Bowling into the off stump or middle stump is to tempt the batsmen to play across the line of the ball and bring lbw into the equation or a bat pad or anything. It is an attacking delivery meant to make the batsmen take risks. Bowling that same delivery over and over again won't help you get wickets as the batsmen would pick what you are trying to do and make the necessary adjustments. You would need to watch entire spells of saqlain bowling rather than the wicket taking clips where he did get a few on middle stumps.
     
  29. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    Wasim might have meant about trying to make him bowl an off stump line when he was bowling outside off stump majorly or drifting down to middle stump.
     
  30. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Dude I have watched Saqlains entire career, modeled my action over him, his career ended in 2003 so dont remember too much of him now but one thing i knew with Saqlain his line was always leg stump whether its a test match or an odi!! I watched all types of cricket whether tests or odis and watched Saqlain bowl throughout his career, maybe I dont remember some or most of his tricks now cus he stopped playing cricket after 2003 and as a result, I stopped bowling with that action and adopted the Afridi bowling action after 2004!! Still bowled offspin as well with Saqlain action after 2004 but with Saqlain not bowling any longer it was difficult to keep up with that action and that spark went of in that action and i started bowling leg spin more with that Afridi action!!
     
  31. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    You seem to be remembering his wicket taking deliveries and not the 20 deliveries he bowled prior to taking a wicket
     
  32. Shaz130
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    Shaz130 Talented

    Dec 29, 2016
    1,019
    I am pretty sure not many will agree with my opinion. But I strongly feel Imad Wasim should be our next captain. I say this because he looks like a nice educated guy who knows how to actually speak in public. I am sick of seeing cricketers like Sarfraz being given captaincy who have no idea how to communicate properly. By giving Imad captaincy I feel it will amp him up to improve his own performance.
     
  33. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    I dont remember what i used to do cus Saqlain stopped playing after 2003 and so did I stopped bowling with that action after couple of years! I got busy in my education as well, stopped playing cricket, played for a while!!
     
  34. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Problem with Imad is that he is not the frontline spinner, he is our 2nd spinner which means that where only one spinner will play it will be Shadab and not Imad and when you dont make it to playing 11 all the time, you dont deserve to be the Captain!!
     
  35. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    As i was saying before the conversation was sidetracked. Doesnt matter who, yep,maybe Sarfraz is a no-no. But bigger picture needs to be on the domestic cricket overhaul
     
  36. Shaz130
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    Shaz130 Talented

    Dec 29, 2016
    1,019
    I know he is not our frontline spinner. He is not even a great overall cricketer. Problem is some people have suggested Babar Azam should be captain. If we pick Babar Azam as captain there is a chance his batting form may dip as he gets more responsibility. We can’t afford to lose such a fine batsmen due to the extra pressure. That is where I feel Imad Wasim comes in. I feel this guy could potentially improve his skills if given responsibility to do so. He looks like a nice educated lad that needs that boost to perform better. As long as he can infuse confidence in this team however he plays won’t effect our outcome since he is a bits and pieces cricketer.

    I agree, however the domestic issue won’t be solved over night. So we gotta make choices for the national team with what ever resources we got.
     
  37. harsha
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    harsha Youngsta Beauty

    Nov 17, 2013
    436
    A Captain first has to make the team on merit. I see only Babar and Haris making the team on merit.
     
  38. Shaz130
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    Shaz130 Talented

    Dec 29, 2016
    1,019
    And both of them already have the responsibility to lead the batting of ODI cricket. If any of them gets captaincy that would add too much pressure on them. Hence why I won’t mind if Imad gets it. He’s not leaving the team anyways for winning against Afganistan the way he did.
     
  39. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
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    and Amir!
     
  40. Shahzad.Firdous
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    Shahzad.Firdous Cornered Tiger

    May 29, 2010
    12,446
    Harris is the most mature person in entire squad. He is the most aged as well and senior most although Amir has been around for ages so I would make Harris Sohail Captain!! Making Babar Azam captain might see a dip in his batting form and making Amir captain i dont see him able to handle that captaincy, he is better off as a player [email protected] You could groom Babar Azam as Vice Captain but Captain got to be none other than Harris. Imad would have made a great captain but he doesnt make the playing 11 always for example today Pakistan should have played an extra batsman and leave out Imad as if we need to bowl out Bangladesh within 30 overs max and 5th and 6th bowlers will therefore not be required today!! Similarly, in many games we need to go with extra batsman to put up a big score on board to be able to defend just like we did with England (Hafeez and Malik bowling 5th bowlers overs), you could bring in Asif Ali as commie is saying right now!!
     

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