Where would Jacques Kallis rank amongst the great all-rounders?

Discussion in 'Cricket Talk' started by Harsh Thakor, May 7, 2019.

Where would Jacques Kallis rank amongst the great all-rounders?

  1. The greatest

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  2. below Sobers

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  3. below Botham and Sobers

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  4. Below Imran,Hadlee,Sobers and Botham

    25.0%
  5. Below Imran ,Hadlee and Botham

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  6. Below Hadlee,Sobers and Imran

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  7. Below Sobers, Imran,Hadlee,Kapil Dev and Botham

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  8. Below Imran,Kapil Dev ,Hadlee and Botham

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  9. Below Sobers and Imran

    25.0%
  10. Below Sobers,Imran and Botham

    25.0%

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  1. Harsh Thakor
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    Harsh Thakor Youngsta Beauty

    May 5, 2011
    390
    There is a strong case for Jacques Kallis to be rated as the best all-rounder of all time or on par or 2nd to Sobers and as the best cricketer of the modern generation.On mere figures Jacques Kallis is the greatest all-rounder ever and amongst the top 5 cricketers of all. His figures are simply stupendous or staggering and surpass even those of Imran ,Sobers and Tendulkar as a cricketer.He also displayed great skill as a fast-medium bolwer able to conjure up incredible pace at times and was technically amongst the soundest of his time who on his day could take any attack to the sword.No doubt he was the equivalent of a comet to the game of cricket.

    However what went against him is that he lacked the 'x ' factor of stalwart like Sobers ,Lara ,Imran,Botham or even Kapil and often did not step the gas sufficiently to win games.Kallis also was not at his best with both bat and ball for most of his career and for major part was great batsmen who bowled.Also not at his best in tests in England and Australia.Eclipsed greatly by Sobers as a match-winner as well as Imran and Miller or Botham in his peak.Kallis was not as explosive as Sobers with the bat or Imran ,Botham,Hadlee or even Kapil with the ball.Kallis also capitalized greatly on the minnow sin test cricket.To me Sobers would rank ahead because the game is not only about statistics and records but also about artistry and creative genius.In that respect Sobers traversed regions unexplored in every department of the game.Kallis did not posesses Sobers great versatlity with the ball or explosiveness or creativity with the bat .Never has Kallis given an all-round performance of the stature of Gary's 722 runs and 20 wickets with the ball in England in 1966 or capture 21 wickest and score 683 run sfor rest of the world in 1968.He has never played an innings in the league of Sobers;s 132 in the tied trset at Brisbane,254 at Melbourne in 1972 or 113 at Kingston in 1968-69 v England.Similarly never equalled Botham's performances in 1980 Jubilee test in Mumbai or 1981 Ashes.Miller in peak eras was considerably better with both bat and ball.Kallis was also not at his best with the bat in England and Australia or against them like Sobers.In peak ear from 196-68 Sobers overshadowed Kallis wit the ball capturing 129 wickets in around 33 tests.For the later part of his career he captured less than 2 wickets per test.



    However Kallis's forte is his longevity which is phenomenal ..In terms of batting average Kallis even overshadowed Tendulkar,Lara or Ponting and was in that respect the best batsmen of his generation.Although not as artistic in terms of all-round consummate skill only Sobers was ahead. He was the best of all all-rounders to bat for your life and in that regard in the Tendulkar-Lara class.Kallis also took 5 wickets and scored a century twice which Imran .Miller or Kapil have never done.He also was outstanding with the ball in some series like against West Indies at home and England in 1998.Significantly he even opened the great South African attack with the new ball which is remarkable.Kallis boasts of a better strike rate than Gary Sobers.Considering his era it would have been very difficult for Kallis to carry such a heavy load with the ball.Kallis made a major contribution in South Africa reaching the top of the pedestal in test cricket unlike Tendulkar,Lara,Botham or Hadlee even if he averaged more in draws than wins.If not the executioner he was the architect of many victories for his side.South Africa with Kallis retained top sport in test cricket for a greater duration than Pakistan with Imran but ofcourse Imran played when West Indies were at their best.Had he played in the 1980's with tracks much more helpful he may well have been the leading all-rounder even if overshadowed by the ball by Imran ,Hadlee,Botham and Kapil.His figures in ODI's were marvellous.Phenomenal performance averaging 44 as a batsmen and 31 with the ball.



    Arguably he has been grossly under rated like at 52nd place in Cristopher Martin Jenkins best 100 list and 80th place in Geoff Armstrong's 100 best.Both rank him below Sobers,Imran ,Miller,Botham,Hadlee and Kapil .I wonder what their criteria was.Only David Gower does him true justice placing him in the top 15 just below Imran and Botham.Great cricketers like Ian Chappell and Mike Procter rated Kallis 2nd to Sobers,ahead of Imran ,Botham,Hadlee and Kapil Dev,doing him more justice.Sadly only 4 cricketers in Richard Sydemham's 100 best xi's selected Kallis in their all-time xi.Sobers was an almost unaninimous choice and the like sof Imran and Botham got many more votes.Strangely even Richard Hadlee, Barry Richards and Mike Procter chose Botham in their all-time team to accompany Sobers,but maybe because Botham was a bowling all-rounder.Colin Croft surprisingly chose Kallis to accompany Sobers.Expert Anantha Narayana on cricifo mathematically ranks Kallis just a whisker behind Sobers,Botham and Imran in that order,but some way above Kapil Dev,Miller and Hadlee.Somehow with a gun on my head I may just vote for Miller,Botham or Imran as a substitute for Sobers as fast bowling all-rounders agree greater match-winners than batting ones.

    Kallis was not as impactful at his best in a single era like Botham,Sobers or Imran or even Kapil Dev but was morally right up there with the best..Although statistically better in terms of average he could not dominate bowling anywhere in the region or league of Lara,Tendulkar or even Ponting.If I had to guess I would place Kallis in 3rd place,behind Sobers and Miller as an all-rounder and on par with Botham and Imran.and amongst the top 15 cricketers of all.However with a gun on my head on another day he may rank a whisker be below the likes of Imran and Botham .I have unanimity that Sobers was no1 but often feel in no man's land where Jacques would actually rank after Sobers. Kallis in my evaluation overall as a cricketer may be a notch below Bradman,Hobbs,Sobers,Imran,Viv Richards ,Tendulkar,Warne,Hammond ,Lara etc and just above Wasim Akram,Sunil Gavaskar,Ian Botham,Adam Gilchrist ,Richard Hadlee ,Dennis Lillee,Len Hutton,Ricky Ponting etc.Kallis was as impactful and lacked the flair of players like Viv Richards,Tendulkar,Brian Lara and Shane Warne.





    STATS COMPILED BY S.RAJESH FROM CRICINFO





    Jacques Kallis' batting career in Tests
    Period Tests Runs Average Strike rate 100s/ 50s
    Till Dec 1998 22 1019 30.87 36.62 2/ 5
    Jan 1999 to Dec 2007 90 8263 65.06 44.96 27/ 41
    Jan 2008 to Feb 2009 17 778 31.12 45.76 1/ 4
    Mar 2009 to Dec 2012 29 2920 67.90 54.21 14/ 6
    2013 8 309 25.75 47.03 1/ 2
    Career 166 13289 55.37 45.97 45/ 58
    Jacques Kallis' bowling career in Tests
    Period Tests Wickets Average Strike rate 5WI Overs/Test
    Till 2002 65 136 28.30 63.80 3 22.4
    2003 to 2008 62 115 34.14 68.1 2 21.0
    2009 onwards 39 41 42.87 90.4 0 15.5
    Career 166 292 32.65 69.2 5 20.2


    Battle of the allrounders
    What set Kallis apart among modern-day allrounders was the fact that he averaged more than 50 with the bat - and was clearly among the best batsmen of his era - and yet took enough wickets to qualify as a genuine allrounder: no other player has achieved the double of 6000 runs and 250 wickets in Tests. Most of the other top allrounders batted at No. 6 or 7 and averaged in the mid-30s with the bat, but Kallis's batting skills were clearly superior.

    The table below lists the top allrounders by the difference between their batting and bowling averages, and the only player with similar stats as Kallis is Garry Sobers - he averaged 57.78 with the bat and 34.03 with the ball, and the difference of 23.74 is marginally higher than Kallis' 22.72.

    The other allrounders all have a difference of less than 15 between their batting and bowling averages, which is where Kallis's numbers stand out. However, Kallis averaged only 1.76 wickets per Test, while the others in the list below (apart from Sobers) took at least three per match.



    The top allrounders in Test cricket (at least 2500 runs and 150 wkts)
    Player Tests Runs Bat ave Wickets Bowl ave Difference*
    Garry Sobers 93 8032 57.78 235 34.03 23.74
    Jacques Kallis 166 13,289 55.37 292 32.65 22.72
    Imran Khan 88 3807 37.69 362 22.81 14.88
    Keith Miller 55 2958 36.97 170 22.97 13.99
    Shaun Pollock 108 3781 32.31 421 23.11 9.19
    Ian Botham 102 5200 33.54 383 28.40 5.14
    Richard Hadlee 86 3124 27.16 431 22.29 4.86
    Chris Cairns 62 3320 33.53 218 29.40 4.13
    Kapil Dev 131 5248 31.05 434 29.64 1.40
    * Difference between batting and bowling averages



    Given the similarity in their numbers, it's clear that Sobers is the one player whose career numbers in both batting and bowling can be compared with Kallis. There's little to choose between their batting averages, but what stands out among the bowling numbers is the amount of overs Sobers bowled per Test - 39, compared with 20 for Kallis.

    Sobers' career stretched over 20 years as well but because of the lesser frequency of matches, he only played 93 Tests, to Kallis's 166. Extrapolating Sobers's numbers after 93 matches and stretching it over 166 Tests, Sobers's career stats go up to 14,337 with 46 hundreds (to Kallis's 13,289 with 45), 195 catches (to Kallis's 200), and 419 wickets (to Kallis's 292). Clearly, the fact that Sobers bowled nearly twice as many overs per match as Kallis contributes to the huge difference in wickets.



    Jacques Kallis' batting career in Tests
    Period Tests Runs Average Strike rate 100s/ 50s
    Till Dec 1998 22 1019 30.87 36.62 2/ 5
    Jan 1999 to Dec 2007 90 8263 65.06 44.96 27/ 41
    Jan 2008 to Feb 2009 17 778 31.12 45.76 1/ 4
    Mar 2009 to Dec 2012 29 2920 67.90 54.21 14/ 6
    2013 8 309 25.75 47.03 1/ 2
    Career 166 13289 55.37 45.97 45/ 58
    Jacques Kallis' bowling career in Tests
    Period Tests Wickets Average Strike rate 5WI Overs/Test
    Till 2002 65 136 28.30 63.80 3 22.4
    2003 to 2008 62 115 34.14 68.1 2 21.0
    2009 onwards 39 41 42.87 90.4 0 15.5
    Career 166 292 32.65 69.2 5 20.2


    Battle of the allrounders
    What set Kallis apart among modern-day allrounders was the fact that he averaged more than 50 with the bat - and was clearly among the best batsmen of his era - and yet took enough wickets to qualify as a genuine allrounder: no other player has achieved the double of 6000 runs and 250 wickets in Tests. Most of the other top allrounders batted at No. 6 or 7 and averaged in the mid-30s with the bat, but Kallis's batting skills were clearly superior.

    The table below lists the top allrounders by the difference between their batting and bowling averages, and the only player with similar stats as Kallis is Garry Sobers - he averaged 57.78 with the bat and 34.03 with the ball, and the difference of 23.74 is marginally higher than Kallis' 22.72.

    The other allrounders all have a difference of less than 15 between their batting and bowling averages, which is where Kallis's numbers stand out. However, Kallis averaged only 1.76 wickets per Test, while the others in the list below (apart from Sobers) took at least three per match.



    The top allrounders in Test cricket (at least 2500 runs and 150 wkts)
    Player Tests Runs Bat ave Wickets Bowl ave Difference*
    Garry Sobers 93 8032 57.78 235 34.03 23.74
    Jacques Kallis 166 13,289 55.37 292 32.65 22.72
    Imran Khan 88 3807 37.69 362 22.81 14.88
    Keith Miller 55 2958 36.97 170 22.97 13.99
    Shaun Pollock 108 3781 32.31 421 23.11 9.19
    Ian Botham 102 5200 33.54 383 28.40 5.14
    Richard Hadlee 86 3124 27.16 431 22.29 4.86
    Chris Cairns 62 3320 33.53 218 29.40 4.13
    Kapil Dev 131 5248 31.05 434 29.64 1.40
    * Difference between batting and bowling averages



    Given the similarity in their numbers, it's clear that Sobers is the one player whose career numbers in both batting and bowling can be compared with Kallis. There's little to choose between their batting averages, but what stands out among the bowling numbers is the amount of overs Sobers bowled per Test - 39, compared with 20 for Kallis.

    Sobers' career stretched over 20 years as well but because of the lesser frequency of matches, he only played 93 Tests, to Kallis's 166. Extrapolating Sobers's numbers after 93 matches and stretching it over 166 Tests, Sobers's career stats go up to 14,337 with 46 hundreds (to Kallis's 13,289 with 45), 195 catches (to Kallis's 200), and 419 wickets (to Kallis's 292). Clearly, the fact that Sobers bowled nearly twice as many overs per match as Kallis contributes to the huge difference in wickets.



    Sobers v Kallis - batting comparison
    Tests Runs Average 100s/ 50s
    Garry Sobers 93 8032 57.78 26/ 30
    Jacques Kallis 166 13,289 55.37 45/ 58
    Sobers v Kallis - bowling comparison
    Wickets Average Strike rate 5WI Overs/Test
    Garry Sobers 235 34.03 91.9 6 39
    Jacques Kallis 292 32.65 69.2 5 20
     
  2. ASLI-PATHAN
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    ASLI-PATHAN Cricistan Khan

    Apr 26, 2011
    63,433
    Stats wise he is the greatest.
     
  3. Passionate Pakistani
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    Passionate Pakistani The Don

    Jun 10, 2011
    68,251
    One of his own kind.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
     
  4. ShokoTolo_LoloMoto
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    ShokoTolo_LoloMoto Talented

    Apr 16, 2010
    1,263
  5. Sultan Yusuf
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    Sultan Yusuf Talented

    Sep 1, 2010
    1,179
    I think you need to separate batting and bowling all rounders. Batting all founders don’t excite me at all.

    As far as in concerned if you’re not good enough to be a front line bowler, you shouldn’t be considered an all rounder
     
  6. Mohammed Bilal
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    Mohammed Bilal Tracer Bullet

    Jul 17, 2017
    7,263
    I think hes the most underrated cricketer, he's probably the second greatest cricketer of all time.
     
  7. Fireworks11
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    Fireworks11 Kaptaan

    Sep 22, 2012
    30,705
    Greatest all rounder I’ve seen.
     
  8. MR__KHAN__JI
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    MR__KHAN__JI Talented

    Sep 5, 2010
    1,615
    Bowling all rounders are more valuable.

    Imran is no 1

    Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
     
  9. Fireworks11
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    Fireworks11 Kaptaan

    Sep 22, 2012
    30,705
    Kallis’ Bowling record is better than many bowling all-rounders.

    He was the definition of a ‘Pure All Rounder’. Could get in the side for his batting or bowling. A very rare cricketer.

    292 test wickets and 273 ODI wickets is no joke. A staggering feat.
     

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